welcome to the b & b [PART 1: N0-N4]

stoat alley.

chinomi: III

high seraph vs.
Luxaria vs. chinomi
Sammiya vs.
AliceofOz vs.
alcasync vs. chinomi
Mr. Alice vs.
T3tsuya vs. chinomi
Tiki the Troll vs.
Rasei vs.
drandahl vs.
plotstickers vs.
eleni vs.
deo vs.
chinomi vs.
Ardonye vs.
Ninfia vs.
Kotakia vs.

has anyone else voted

ALSO:
- Kiyoko will be doing vote tallies when I'm asleep.
- If you have any questions about roles or other things other players are not privy to know, please let me know ASAP unless you're willing to wait until morning.

sorry it's taking me a long time to reply iM HAVING A REALLY BAD DAY. i know it's frustrating to wait for people to defend themselves, though, so i really do apologize. it's the wrong day for people to suspect me SCREAMS.

Luxaria wrote:You proposed that since she has to be town as a result, then her sending you the message makes you town just because you shared it with the thread. What? Why wouldn't mafia in your position come forward with information that Plotstickers is pro-town? I can think of a scenario, and it's what you're doing right now: Your entire case for being town, as far as you've expressed, is that a pro-town role sent you a message identifying themself, and that you can't be mafia because if you were you wouldn't reveal a town. So you're creating your own logic to back up the case, as well as immediately jumping on it as a case for being town.

THAT
would be
a smart plan .................................

i wish i could take credit for that but i didn't think that hard into it at all when i initially did it i mean heck i was like throwing myself at it in the thread via mobile when i first realized it.

i think it's about time i revealed my role because with the lack of votes today i really do fear a last minute bandwagon on me. i'm sort of like a reverse-voodoo role (is that what these roles are called? please let me know). i can target a room each night and if the room i chose contains a SINGLE mafia member then they can only post gibberish the next day so i can find mafia members if i AIM RIGHT AND TRUE which i thought would be initially useful but targeting rooms has been harder than i originally thought.

i'm not sure why my roomie hasn't claimed but i kind of believe they have a reason not to if they haven't. i'm going to stick myself to letting them come out and say it if they want to. however, i will say that i did NOT have a roomie last night. doesn't look good on my end but i have to be truthful.

Thanks, Ninfia!

Okay, so 12 rooms had occupants not including Kiyoko. That's 16 players. We have 4 claimed paired rooms.

A)
8 players paired up as roommates, 3 claimed solos, and 5 unaccounted for:
3 claimed solos, 5 unaccounted solos, and 4 claimed pairings = 12 rooms.

Lines up. There's other possible variations, such as...

B)
6 players paired up as roommates, 3 claimed solos, 6 unaccounted for, and 1 stealth:
3 claimed solos, 6 unaccounted solos, 3 claimed pairings, 1 stealth (in another room) = 12 rooms

The presence of stealth would support my theory of mafia possibly lying about rooming up with others in other rooms. There might even be a stealth on both sides, though I don't know how likely that is (and it'd require some crazy room rearranging in my equation...).

Nautilus has hinted there might be a stealth, and considering how much she emphasized the intricacies of these mechanics... I'm inclined to believe there is one? Maybe that's faulty logic?

But if we assume that there is a stealth, it might suggest that one claimed pairing has lied and there's actually a stealth in another room.

Brain hurts too much to find out if this is feasible for previous phases at the moment.


Tl;dr: Either all possible doubled-up rooms have been claimed, or one pairing is comprised of lying mafia and there's a stealth in another room.

Got this question so I'm going to post it!

Current ratio is 10:5:1

ANYWAYS: I'm going to bed now so unless someone has a question they can ask me in the morning! o7 Kiyoko will vote tally for the next few hours.

I don't believe you, to be honest. Questions:

1)
Which rooms did you target on which nights?

2)
What results have you received? Have your actions gone through?

3)
Define gibberish. What does it look like? How do the players do it? Nautilus isn't a mod. She cannot forcibly change players' posts or enforce them posting gibberish.

4)
What happens if the mafia is in a room with another player? And what happens to that other player? If the room contains a single mafia, it doesn't do anything on a room with two mafia in it?

5)
Okay, your roomies haven't claimed. Tell me their names, then, and which night you had them, and in what rooms.

6)
Also, what is your role name?


edit:

((for the record, I apologize for coming on strongly, especially when you've had a bad day. :c I hope your night clears up and you have a good rest, okay? ;w; <33)

1)
#8
#27
#16

2) I've received nothing noting my actions in PM and haven't seen any gibberish in thread so I assume they all failed.

3) Well, it's the same way I assume the Silence is enabled? Nautilus can't force anyone not to post and I've seen similar roles to mine in previous games. As for the gibberish the role power mentions that they will be forced to constantly stutter or stammer or else a penalty will be placed on them. I'm not sure what she meant by PENALTY but she mentioned it'd affect the game negatively in toward them.

4) It mentions that it only works if it's a mafia member who is alone in the room since my role can't successfully 'confront' and 'intimidate' them.

5) I'm not going to. I know this is scummy as hell but they obviously have a good reason not to. It may relate to their power in some way and I'm not wiling to sacrifice someone else's position in the game over saving myself.

6) The Principal. I can confront and intimidate the 'bad kids' (players) and make them stutter and stammer during the day if my target is successful.

Honestly, this is such a weird role that if I were to fake role claim I would go with something more simple like protector or a kind of cop.

I sincerely expected to come back to the thread looking at my own post from a few hours ago. Wow.

Luxaria wrote:GOOD LORD BIG POST

This was stupid insightful and just the kind of speculation I was hoping would get going today. We now have something to go off of that we didn't before, and in my mind it's a little safer to build upon this than the perpetual uncertainty of the Mr Alice situation. Let me clarify a few things about this post, and Mr Alice we're going to get back to the situation with you in a second.

To add to room arrangement based speculation in the future, I feel it's very important to remember Naut's page 1 post

Certain roles may not count towards the room limit and allow for 3 players to be in a room together. Players with these roles will be informed about these loopholes.

Certain roles may not count toward the room limit.
Roles. In the plural.

Additionally I think we do have to remember when speculating based on this that no matter what the case is, only one singular person in maf needs to be alone for a NK to be attempted. The rest of Maf could very well integrate themselves with town rooms the best they can based on previous singular people claiming they were in a room alone. (Rasei N0, Kotakia N0, Luxaria N1, Ninfia N1) for both security from kill effects and for plausible deniability. Unless they had an ability that demanded they move rooms, they could easily hang out with town based on speculated room positions.

So what I'm saying from this is I think we need to be looking for people who were specifically not willing to or cannot confirm their room placement on nights where that single person missing obviously caused trouble. (Last night, the phase the trap was set. Etc etc.) And as a guideline for lynching, not a rule. Because

we know that, if everyone has been honest, then rooms 18, 19, 22, 26, 1, and 3 cannot have the trap in them

it's never that cut and dry in mafia.

I feel this becomes another situation in which we have to be inside Mafia's head like with Mr Alice, and we just can't do that for sure. I personally think maf would have been more defensive and willing to group up due to the fact that this is a game with unexpected roles that could possibly out the fact they're lying about their room placement.

I feel that this is backed up by the staggering fact no one has been hit by maf yet outside of that possibly maf affiliated targeted role last night. (I still think it was a neutral role as no neutral role has come forward to contest that.)
It means it is most likely there's been a lot of empty rooms and the failed NKs we've seen were likely due to being bounced out.

And so for reasons I feel will be apparent to those who enjoy speculating super hard.
Night 0: Tiki was in a room with eleni
Night 2: Tiki was in a room with Ardonye
These are facts. I don't know the numbers. But due to Ardonye posting up what he posted up I am 1000% sure he is Town.


On Chinomi

When she posted up about the note I really didn't understand what she meant by "a message", which is why I asked her at the time. That ended up being overshadowed by the Alice situation and other suspicions for me fairly quickly after that. Lux discerned and summed up everything in a way I couldn't in that post and I seriously do not see the fault in any of it. Chinomi instantly tried to establish both her and plotstickers as town based on something that, by it's nature, could not be corroborated by anybody. And backed it up by shaky logic that could only be traced back to herself.

As someone who is extremely well versed in constructing their own tower of BS and then living in it as Mafia. This seems pretty clear to me.

VOTE: chinomi unless she can pull the most convincing evidence ever out of nowhere tonight.

I seriously want to hear more from plotstickers about this as well.

Mr. Alice wrote:OK
OK
OK OK OK

I HECKED UP

I HECKED UP REALLY BAD

...

just your standard invisible bullet thing

Alright. This is getting a little ridiculous. If, at this point, Mr Alice is mafia we would know who made the vig kill and then we can lynch her for doing it. I think right now we have more obvious and safe leads to go off of than this because even if she is maf, she can't do anything relating to her power without us demolishing her for doing it. I am starting to believe that maybe Mr Alice is just really that scummy in normal play. I am electing to learn from the last game where I burned down the entire house to take down one incredibly scummy lead and I'm letting go of this for nowin lieu of better information.

But I seriously vote to keep an eye on Alice for the rest of the game regardless.

And for the love of god please explain "INVISIBLE BULLET"

Now time for me to respond to all the posts I missed while writing this one.

Also, @ Kotakia: Very well. That does sound kind of neutral, then, but it's very scummy to just kill Kiyoko. If they're neutral, I could see them targeting Kiyoko as sacrifice and hoping she dies (because she's Kiyoko), but again, it keeps coming back to the wording of the role information you received. It just sounds way, way too unlikely for it to be anything other than one packaged bundle.

Do you think mafia would have a vigilante that could possibly kill themselve--

Wait.

Hmmmm. Every two nights without a kill, right? Say, Kotakia, do you know if it works like:

A)
N1 no kill
N2 no kill
N2<D3 ROOM DESTRUCTION

or

B)
N1 no kill
N2 no kill
N3 ROOM DESTRUCTION

But either way, you know that might not be a bad trade-off for mafia. They could use it to guarantee one kill on a player, lower the room count, and between that and a possible two traps floating around, it may or may not increase the chances of mafia getting a kill each night, especially if the room destruction has a lowered chance of taking out mafia (since there's 5 of them), while simultaneously putting town on a clock.

A trade-off that's still slightly skewed in mafia's favor for the sake of dodging the entire room mechanic of the game and guaranteeing a kill of their choice (or two, if they're lucky).

Also, notice no mafia were in that room either. I mean they could be anywhere, but still... still...

Anyway, mafia or extremely scummy neutral ability. I'll buy the random room destruction as a mafia role. The flavor does feel like it might be neutral, but the more I think about it...

Edit: Reading Chinomi and T3tsuya's posts now.

Luxaria wrote:I'll give you delicious banana and chocolate chip pancakes if you answer! ^_^ <33

w-ELL! someone knows how things work around here! asking nicely and giving me food! * q *

Luxaria wrote:Can you fire your Hunter shot during either phase? Does the action resolve as soon as you send it in, or does it resolve at rollover?

shots fired!! haha, that can only be done at night :( night hunting doesn't really sound like the safest thing in the world, but i don't make the rules :'(

Luxaria wrote:Is it one-use?

umm not quite sure if i want to answer this yet, just in case it's one of things where it's bad if maf knows, but i think if you can read me well enough in my previous posts, you might be able to tell what the answer is

Luxaria wrote:You target a player with it, correct?

my answer's gonna be about the same with the above reply, but i will say that my reluctance in answering both of these is mostly due to me like, not being sure if it's something that would ONLY be able town (which i kinda feel it's not??) i totally understand that it's helpful in general for other people to know, but i just don't want it to be helpful for mafia at all

Luxaria wrote:Do you have this role for the rest of the game? And will it be your only role?

;' n '; does the fact that i'm upset about having this role at all help you with the answer? again, i don't wanna say it outright, but i think you might be able to tell based on my reactions so far

Luxaria wrote:Is there anything else you can tell us?

i'll use this time to go back to the first two unanswered questions, and add that hm.....i guess if enough people weigh in on whether it'd be more helpful or not to explicitly answer them, i can see how i feel about it then?

cuz idk, i know that since i'm one of the people being under suspicion, and i don't contribute anything to speculation anyway, but a lot of my role info/night actions is already out there which alsokinda makes me uncomfortable and (ﾉ´ｰ`)ﾉ you know?

also wow this might be the longest post i've ever made BUT it was mostly b/c of answering several questions at once, so this doesn't count! >:((( /happily starts on these pcaks b/c these are def one of my fav flavor combos

@T3t: i explained the invisible bullet thing! not sure if you missed that edit, or if it's still unclear, but again, it doesn't really mean anything according to nautilus, so just think of it as a normal bullet? holla if that still doesn't make sense, i'll try harder :'(

I'm inclined to believe chi's claim, actually. It doesn't feel like the normal kind of claim chi would make if she was trying to make something up.

Town-leaning:
Luxaria
Alcasync
T3Tsuya
Kotakia
eleni

Middle-ground/no real feeling:
Mr Alice
Chinomi
AliceofOz
Tiki
Ardonye
Ninfia

????:
Deo
High Seraph
Rasei
Plot

I honestly don't know who to vote for right now.

For Blaire <3:

I am still curious about your stuff, since you're under suspicion and anything you say makes us more likely to believe you, if you're being cooperative and honest, but you've worked with us pretty well insofar. And I understand wanting to keep quiet about your role and similar!

I'll let the others decide if they want to know more. However, as T3t says, I will be keeping an eye on you, and I think you realize that if you use the vigilante kill on anyone other than what the confirmed town recommend, town will not take kindly to it. Okay?

(P.S. T3t: She specified that the "invisible bullet" sort of was part of the flavor of her role text, due to however she copies it, I think?)

Edit:

Sammiya wrote:I'm inclined to believe chi's claim, actually. It doesn't feel like the normal kind of claim chi would make if she was trying to make something up.

That said, we also have reason to believe Mr. Alice might have been framed. This suggests a very clever mafia. They could have planned for this scenario. I know some mafia teams draft up entire sets of roles to use in a pinch. And this one sounds so... how do I put it.

It sounds like it was written specifically so it wouldn't possibly contradict any existing roles?

I'm still in the pretty sure the room destroying role is not neutral. I don't think that kind of ability would make it to a neutral person-- because as Lux said its wayyy too mafia skewed. it helps them out way more.

I guess this is sort of going off my interpretation of a lot of the lore around the house that Naut is building up too.

Re: Mr. alice, I more or less agree that at the moment, there are more threatening groups than her. I can see the reasons that people are ??? at her but I also just am not seeing anything actually threatening about the way she's conducting. I can understand her wanting to withhold some information about her role so she doesn't get hunted down by the mafia.

Re: Chi, I kind of agree with Sammiya here in that the claim is so... its a complex claim. It isn't something I could see anyone coming up with because it does seem kind of out there? @_@ there's a lot to think about!

Chi does make a good point in the enforcement of her role too, in that it works in the same way as the silencer. This is an honour system even if some people are scummy. :P

I think at this point it would be best to hear from plot? if memory serves, they're the only person who hasn't come up to at least defend against accusations/address them at the very least.

ok so i've caught up but i guess i kinda am still lost as to where the current conversation is other than it's about chi being scummy but

although it seems like people are think of chi and plot (and kotakia?????) as an item or something, is there anything besides plot sending chi a letter that suggests that? anyway, going off of what i've been trying to stress a bit by looking into roomies and shiz, I find it really, really off that chinomi is the only person that has claimed simply a partner; no room, no identity of partner

the only reason i could think of why someone would want to do this consistently is if the two people are in some kind of cahoots and trying to lead to wifom situations with mafia buddies and fakeclaiming rooms to make them appear as safe (i believe Luxaria already brought this up kinda) perhaps this could even lead to a situation just by my bringing it up, but as long as we're aware of that possibility now i guess that's okay

or... if no partner exists at all

i'm really tempted to vote chinomi but i guess i'll wait for this to be addressed or something inb4 this was already addressed and somehow i missed it

also Sammiya what are your doubts on Ardonye? if you don't mind me asking