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Gakuen Mafia Season 2: School Festival [EP00-EP10]

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By the way, I know we're all waiting for Pocha to come confirm my claim, but I have an important request.

Pocha, when you come to the thread, please do not reveal any more information about my role. Sorry if I'm repeating myself, but seeing as you wanted the whateverproof to claim (which... I didn't think was the best course of action, so I didn't follow it even though I could), I need to stress that the town will not benefit from knowing my role information. If it looks like I'm about to be lynched again, I might come clean and reveal all I have. If I end up dying, feel free to make my role public like you did Kiyo's. But until then, please leave my dark secret just between you and me.

What I'm asking exactly is that you don't go any farther than saying "Lucas's claim is legit" or "I didn't mean 'bulletproof' in such a strict sense". I'm not sure exactly how your role works, but I'm willing to give you a few more hints about my role so that you can contrast it to your notes, in case what I've said so far hasn't been convincing enough. To recap, these are the two things that I have already made public:

- I can survive a kill or lynch*
- Another aspect of my role is triggered after being killed or lynched, and this aspect in particular is what convinces you that the bulletproof** is town

*fun fact: minutes after I received my role pm, sensei acted all embarrassed saying "I MEANT DETENTION NOT KILL what kind of school is this" and it was rly cute. nautilus is cute
**actually killproof. just putting the Mafia Grammar Police might be reading

now im gonna go back to doing some weird summoning chants pls excuse me


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[16:41:10] Kiyo / 7♦: “so lucas what do you think about this lynch?”
[16:41:10] Kiyo / 7♦: “hHHHhhhhhh hHHHHHHHHHH HHHHhhhHHhh"
[16:41:36] lucasssss: "lucas i want u to bus me and lynch me this phase"
[16:41:39] lucasssss: "HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH"
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alright, for the record, the way high seraph talked about his role makes me believe he's legit, or that at the very least he's obtained the exact same amount of information that I have. THOUGH:

my Mystic Eye just saw another role, that's most likely the "mafia role cop" kiyoko mentioned, that's ALSO got a bulletproof aspect to it:

"During the night, you can investigate one player and learn of their role power, but not their relationship ability.
In addition, you can survive one kill or one lynch on your person."

especially because the previous bulletproof person I saw that may or may not be high seraph was worded so clearly as town AND because of the conclusion kiyoko drew that I'm inclined to believe is correct, I'm of the belief that this one is mafia, which is why I didn't bother with asking around and just posted what I saw. if this is actually a town role... oops, I apologize for my hobbledehoy skills at this game pfff

and I guess... if this is the role that acted on kiyoko, she probably didn't know and/or didn't inherit the passive part of the ability, because she clearly wasn't immune to the kill that... killed her. or maybe it got used up when she investigated minji, I don't know.

but anyway, just a heads-up that surviving a kill/lynch is... apparently not grounds for clearing just yet.

ETA: also re:ninfias, you said your vig skill is one-shot? ok, that raises the question of what exactly happened n0 with the two kills, since I would've just assumed they came from the same source, but hmm.

ETA2: I... get to act again tonight, so if Sammiya sees this, trusts me, is willing to help out and has no better target in mind, I wouldn't mind that lollipop!

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Hi hello. Rollover will be late tomorrow by anywhere from 1-2 hours because I have a thing at 11am.

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I'm tired of using tables.

@piplups, yes, my vig kill was 1 shot. whatever happened night zero had nothing to do with me.

Okay, essentially, here's what's going on in my head with all this lucas lynchproof shenanigans:

between Ezzelin and high seraph, one is mafia.

I was one of the people who confessed to kiyoko and I got a rejection response that said "ezzelin will be hard to kill". At this point, I'm not actually sure which is what. I'll chew on it for the next day phase, provided I survive. I think Ezzelin is probably the one Kiyo investigated because it seemed to me everything else she told me was based on reads (and is more or less irrelevant and this point because the players are dead). So, based on this I'm willing to believe that one of them is town, and one is mafia. unfortunately, I also believe that Lucas being town is worst case scenario because unless there's another vig kill out there, Ezzelin will take two lynches to kill and we can't afford to do that yet.

re: the rest of the mafia:

Alcasync, Cure, Sammiya, Angelstar.

Potentially swap out Cure for Cur3, if he's playing me like a fiddle. (Stop it Mulder, I don't care about mothman. I'm a medical doctor.) and maybe swap out sammiya for luxaria if I'm being played like a bigger fiddle. like. A cello. plz don't do this, my deerheart. I know I have a bow, but it's not meant for playing strings, its meant for arrows.

most of this is process of elimination when it comes to my reads.

I'm town. I read lux as town. Deo is now confirmed town as much as you can be. I read Cur3 as town. I read piplups as town based on her actions. Gerry is most likely town. Minji's role is pretty town. Lulu reads as town to me.  

Alca: pretty quiet, makes sense to me that she could be maf. I tend to be quieter when I'm maf, but I'm also quiet early game in general as I'm gathering my reads. However, its late game though and real life is a thing soooo its hard to argue against her.

Cure: the empty rollovers + kiyo kill reads as a cure play to me. its probably not her role, but it was a play that has her fingerprints all over it, tbh. Kiyo was also under the impression cure was maf so I've been operating under that since she died.

Sammiya: been over this, but idk because it could really go either way between her and  lux and I'm putting my heart in with lux.

Angelstar: classic playing lowkey maf style. this one is the most process of elimination. could maybe swap her out for Lulu, because I've only played with lulu as maf, really so I don't know her playstyle, but my gut says town.

also, Taki, I just realized I've been leaving you hanging for like a whole phase omg I'm sorry. I will respond soon.


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@ lulu
lulu wrote:In a game like this I can see it being useful for a townsperson because it opens up opportunities for them to receive information via message alliances / confessions, but I don't see why it couldn't be a mafia role to broadcast a fake alignment to clear yourself? I'm imagining something like a mafia role that can "reveal" any player as town or mafia in rollover, or a mafia role that can "reveal" themselves as town but still flips as mafia upon investigation or death.

A major factor is simply that the role is an established one called innocent child (you can google "innocent child mafia" and see what I mean). It's true that there could be variations on this role, but the main reason why I'm inclined to believe it is...

lulu wrote:If the argument is that people should be able to trust that rollovers are always truthful, then that also precludes the existence of death millers and tailors which from my understanding aren't uncommon roles.

I disagree with the mechanical underpinning of this statement. In my mind, and maybe this is a flawed perspective, I view millers and tailors as affecting a part of the game that's not directly part of rollover. When a player dies, that's included in the rollover, but it's not the rollover. The alignment flip is merely an extension of their death.

What was broadcast at the end of last night phase was part of the rollover. It had nothing to do with a player flip; it was role related information straight from the host, and it directly follows the spirit of innocent child. Could it be mafia leaning? Possibly, but if so I think it is horrible game design, and I outlined why in my previous post. There's two other reasons: Mafia already had one ability that interacted on the rollover, and in my experience with games of this type, mafia typically do not directly overlap in function. Maybe there are two rollover abilities on one single person.

The other reason is simply... for your example of being able to target any player, why use it to clear deo? From what memory serves, most suspicions on him were due to low activity. Why not just have him post/vote more and use it to clear someone else?

lulu wrote:To be clear, I don't feel strongly about this, otherwise I would have voted for one of them (both Deo & Minji have contributed less than Sammiya in terms of speculation). I also thought it wasn't really worth getting into extensive hypotheticals when it distracts from better lynch candidates.

The main reason the off-handed comment bothers me--and I'm trying not to let bias rule me--is that I'm getting a similar read as I got in last gakuen, and you were mafia in that. Granted, half the read in that game came from you suspecting Kiyoko of being mafia (which she was) before you got recruited, at which point you changed track with what felt like a sloppy argument. But now you're in this game and what keeps rubbing me the wrong way is that everytime something pro-town comes up, you immediately throw some suspicions on it, like you're trying to veer town away from it. But it's also frustrating because I am a paranoid player, too, so it's hard to fault you.

There is something else that I've been thinking about. Intermissions typically indicate an action that takes place instantly during the phase. Like deaths, revives, elections, so on and so forth... and guns. And only yourself and Ninfia have weapons in your character profiles, with I think Ezz having mentions of explosions pre-4kids. Ninfia claimed a vigilante shot, but we know nothing of your role. However, in the phase where Kiyoko died, there were two intermissions.

@ Gerry

Can you ask sensei if a gun was made and fired this game?

@ high seraph situation

I don't have anything to add to the discussion that has not already been said, however... what feels very strange to me is that piplups specifically said:

piplups wrote:if your role is bulletproof... feel free to claim if you want and I'll back you up if you can provide the correct details of your power? at least, from just the non-flavor bits I have here, this power sounds like something that would be of much more benefit if publically claimed!

If she thinks it's very beneficial to be aired in a public claim, it makes me extremely suspicious as to why Lucas would repeat in every post that he does not want knowledge of it aired. I will admit I'm also a bit confused as to which bulletproof/lynchproof/whateverproof roles have what and how many are floating around in this discussion. If I'm reading it correctly, piplups is claiming she has seen two roles with some form of killproof on them, and Lucas claimed the first mention, with now a second mention of a role with killproof having an investigative component? Am I following that correctly?

Edit: Ninja'd--or should I say Ninfia'd? Reading, but posting this. ;w;


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The correct term is ninfija'd.

edit:
my attempts to help the town seem to be this video at this point


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BACK UP EVERYONE. END GAME COMING THROUGH.






Ninfi☆ wrote:

between Ezzelin and high seraph, one is mafia.

re: the rest of the mafia:

Alcasync, Cure, Sammiya, Angelstar.

This jives with my list extremely well and realistically, at this point, I still feel High Seraph being maf is the smart guess with what we know and how he's acting. We have a person feeding us information that hasn't done us wrong so far, there's two roles high seraph's lynch/bullet/deathproof ability could fit and one seems to be a maf role cop. That could be high seraph's 'Dark Power'.

However

Mafia investigator with 1 extra life that could get her out of trouble. It's what we're looking for.

a klutz who photographs for the school newspaper and relies on her pet to get into slightly fewer accidents than she would otherwise

This is angelstar's original / current text describing her role. Fits that description to a T. Astoundingly so. I can literally think of no reality where these things do not fit together exactly.
Angelstar has been on our radar for awhile, and frankly if she had relevant powers as a town of any kind, she would have said something. Hell. Said ANYTHING by now. The only time she really has was to defend herself and then she went back to obscurity.

Angelstar and High Seraph are our 2 deathproof roles remaining. Of that I am almost absolutely certain. And to be honest I feel like the circumstance of how she's been this game combined with the coincidence of her trope fitting our missing role exactly, it fits her very nicely into mafia.

(Which means my insane goddamn Illuminati post was RIGHT and everyone will have to recognize and respect that. Upon learning I am correct I demand 5 gold stars from the teacher so I can put them on my shirt collar, declaring myself 5-Star General in the fight against the NEW WORLD ORDER.)

And even with the knowledge that we're likely looking for Angelstar here, it's slightly dangerous to lynch her first because it will fail and cause the Town/Maf gap to get even smaller.


I'm posting this now just in case this next phase goes weird. I won't be around for rollover and someone important will likely die. But I want to leave behind this bit of wisdom just in case.

Ninfia's list and my list for remaining maf are very, very similar. That list posted again, here.


  • Ezz or high seraph
  • Alcasync
  • Not Cure in the Least
  • Sammiya
  • Angelstar


It's not for absolutely no reason that our lists are similar, at this point in the game significant things have happened to ultimately be enough to start getting answers by process of elimination.

Piplups has proven to be a big help with their investigations.

Ninfia has spectacularly stated her town intentions, and followed through, even if it failed. If anybody wants to call the possibility of a one-shot Ninfia vig kill and a one-shot deathproof hate magnet Minji working together to ruse everyone as mafia, you are actually insane. They would lose far too much in one play even if they were cleared. This is objective truth.

It should be obvious what I am at this point. And if people aren't clued in you could ask the person sitting at the desk in front of you. They probably have the list of abilities checked off to the point where they can place me.

There is a very short list of people we know almost nothing about, and that list is right there. The people we do know things about are very pro-town and several of them are provably so. Going forward we need to be decisive, careful, and nearly unanimous in our votes. If we aren't, we can be picked off. So knowing that, think about this plan logically.



Do not stray from this list. Vote someone on it.



If you are town, you are obligated to go after the people who have not proven their ability as helpful. That is your job as a townie. And the people who haven't proven their abilities are on this list. Even if you don't agree with the FULL list, mathematically, there is an incredibly low chance that nobody on the list is maf. There is going to be someone to vote for, so vote for them.

If you were maf, you are obviously in a situation where you will have to lie eventually to cover up the proven town roles. This means at some future juncture, to win the game, a maf will have to stray from this list barring some kind of hidden vig shenanigans. They'll have to cast doubt on people who have established themselves as acting in the interest of town. And if everyone holds fast to this rule of being unanimous and not wavering, it will be very obvious who is attempting to cast the most doubt.

For the rest of the game I would like everyone to trust their established neighbor and immediately and violently tunnel anybody who's defense is to cast doubt on someone we haven't been talking about at length already.



If Ninfia or I die this will be made even clearer by the fact that people will at least know for sure this isn't misleading speculation. Though if Ninfia or I are killed at this point, it will be apparent that it's because we tripped over some truth.

Though all of that is irrelevant because I'm presenting a situation where I am arguing that AwfulAscotPrissyLaLaMan over there is likely town due to the evidence we have. That alone is obviously humiliating enough for me, there is no room for me to try to be misleading on top of that and that is enough to make this post believable and something to subscribe to.


I just want to tell you all, good luck. We're all counting on you.



Time to sleep on my desk again.

GEE I WISH WE WERE ALLOWED TO GO HOME TO SLEEP, AT LEAST.

OR HAVE A FUTON OR SOMETHING.

EVEN A PILLOW, I'D BE GOOD WITH A PILLOW.

I'll just

Continue using my sister.

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Sammiya

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Except I am not mafia, so that list is incorrect in my case.

I've been nothing but transparent about my role power. Kiyoko believe me to be town and she was town, and piplups also confirmed at one point that there was a role like I described in this game. So, yes, my role exists, and was confirmed by one known town member and one quite-possibly town member.

piplups wrote:also thanks to the information I received, I can corroborate sammiya's claims - or at least that her power does exist in this game, since that's what my Mystic Eye saw tonight.

Do I know who mafia is? Not in the slightest. Do I think some of the people on that list might be mafia? Possibly.

And since the people who I send the lollipops don't get told (outside of Kiyoko, but that was due to role ability), I can't really prove it unless a stun happens to be aimed at whoever it is, but the only way that'd happen outside of luck is if I said who it was, and then there's a possibility of a busdriver swapping it or the mafia killing them, or who knows the hell what.


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Sammiya

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Also if I was mafia I would have used my ability on whoever would send in the NK meaning that even with Minji's move the NK at least would've gone through since I'm fairly certain my role trumps Minji's.

And I wouldn't have ever used it on Kiyoko if I was mafia either. I would've stuck to whichever mafia member was the Nker.


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Thank you for the lists, T3t and Ninfia, but I have a different one.

Ninfia wrote:between Ezzelin and high seraph, one is mafia.

I think you might be lying about getting a message from Kiyoko. I'm way more inclined to believe T3t's theory about Angel being the bulletproof than your rejection letter claim atm.

It doesn't make sense for Ezzelin to be mafia. Yes she has been inactive, but from looking back on her posts, it's hard to believe she could be mafia. From what I can recall after looking through the thread like three other times for chart-building purposes, Ezz was about the only other person, besides Kiyo, who expressed some sort of concern over drandahl, pointing that something in his posts rubbed her the wrong way. If she was mafia, she wouldn't have jumped on that vote so soon, and she very definitely wouldn't try to put more salt on drandahl's wound by saying that. This isn't hard evidence of her innocence. But I feel like if she was just trying to put her vote somewhere as early as possible before realizing that the drandahl lynch wagon was going full speed ahead, she wouldn't have committed to her vote by implicating herself with "I DO think drandahl is mafia". In this context, it makes a lot more sense for someone like me to be mafia -- I voted drandahl, but I was like, "hello vote drandahl whatever", I didn't link myself to my vote, so nobody would be too ??? if I came back and unvoted at some point.

I'm not mafia tho, just so we're clear.

Ninfia wrote:Sammiya: been over this, but idk because it could really go either way between her and  lux and I'm putting my heart in with lux.

Yes, Sammiya's role could be mafia-aligned, and I know this well, since I've had this power both as town (Kanji in 19a) and as mafia (Gakuen S1). Determining which side Sammie is on should be a priority, but Kiyo already did that when she stole Sammie's lollipop powers and confirmed that they work in the most pro-town way possible. Also, it doesn't make sense (ANY sense) for mafia to waste the opportunity of boosting their own NK and boost Kiyo's action instead, even if you think they might have been trying to earn Kiyo's trust and, consequently, the thread's. It works, as a gambit, but at the very start of the game, I'm p sure the mafia would be trying as hard as they could to slim the town ratio, and that means they NEEDED this lollipop bad.

Sammie is not mafia.

Ninfia wrote:Ninfia has spectacularly stated her town intentions, and followed through, even if it failed. If anybody wants to call the possibility of a one-shot Ninfia vig kill and a one-shot deathproof hate magnet Minji working together to ruse everyone as mafia, you are actually insane. They would lose far too much in one play even if they were cleared. This is objective truth.

Obviously, Minji and Ninfia can't be mafia at the same time. Even more obviously, there is no way in hell that Minji is mafia. But the fact that Minji acted the same night Ninfia fired her last arrow does not, in any way, clear Ninfia from suspicion. She has acted very pro-town all game, contributed a lot to speculation, and I admit I need to look over her posts once more in order to make up my mind about her. But she could still be mafia. In fact, I'm very close to believing that she is mafia, and the reason is exactly what T3t pointed out -- we don't know a whole lot about Ninfia, do we? We know her claim. But we don't know anything else besides that.

I've been going through the thread like crazy since yesterday, and I've gone through each rollover and each claim as best as I could. I also have a suspects list, and it's different then yours, but it's also not final. Alca and Angel are very definitely mafia, and if we don't want to waste our next Day phase on lynching the mafia bulletproof (Angel), I suggest we go for alca instead. The other maf candidates in my list are Ninfia, Lux and Cure. But, like I said, I'm still going to go through this thread one more time and double-triple-check everything because this is better than studying for my test.

Luxaria wrote:If she thinks it's very beneficial to be aired in a public claim, it makes me extremely suspicious as to why Lucas would repeat in every post that he does not want knowledge of it aired.

How beneficial each player thinks an information is, or where they stand in regards to claiming/outing is subjective, obviously. I think what Pocha meant is that the "bulletproof" (by which she meant killproof) should have claimed and provided details about their role so that we could have 1 less person to suspect in our lists. However, thinking only of her ultimate goal, I think she may have overlooked the consequences that making this information public would cause. Yes, the town would know my full role and I would probably be off the hook. But the mafia would get their hands on information that would highly priviledge them in exchange. And I don't think that's the smartest way to go about it.

Yes, I am being secretive about the remaining aspects of my role. It's also for your own good.


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[16:41:10] Kiyo / 7♦: “so lucas what do you think about this lynch?”
[16:41:10] Kiyo / 7♦: “hHHHhhhhhh hHHHHHHHHHH HHHHhhhHHhh"
[16:41:36] lucasssss: "lucas i want u to bus me and lynch me this phase"
[16:41:39] lucasssss: "HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH"
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Hello I am here again clarifying that rollover will be late today. Actions and messages will still have a hard cutoff at noon, but I have something I need to be at today that may cut into my time with writing rollover.

o/

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Hello I have returned. I'm horribly sick, but I have access to wifi now /o/

First, to respond to some concerns directed at me:

lulu wrote:@ezzelin
To be clear, did Kiyoko say explicitly that: 1. she was staying with alcasync, 2. if she dies while in a relationship with alca, then alca must be maf? Or is this information you have from other sources?
Kiyo explicitly said to me that if she gets sent to detention before alca-chan, that means alca is maf.

Ninfi☆ wrote:between Ezzelin and high seraph, one is mafia.

I was one of the people who confessed to kiyoko and I got a rejection response that said "ezzelin will be hard to kill". At this point, I'm not actually sure which is what. I'll chew on it for the next day phase, provided I survive. I think Ezzelin is probably the one Kiyo investigated because it seemed to me everything else she told me was based on reads (and is more or less irrelevant and this point because the players are dead). So, based on this I'm willing to believe that one of them is town, and one is mafia. unfortunately, I also believe that Lucas being town is worst case scenario because unless there's another vig kill out there, Ezzelin will take two lynches to kill and we can't afford to do that yet.

Incorrect. I will definitely not take two attempts to kill.

I was also one of the people who confessed to kiyo, and she told me that I'm one of the people she trusts the most outside of those she investigated.

kiyo also believed that high seraph is town, and the rest of her reads and guesses that I've received, including those about powers she didn't even investigate, were correct so far.

ok now lists. I'll make a more thorough one with reasoning /comments later when I don't feel like my body's trying to kill me, but for now this will have to do--

def town:
gerry
deo
minji
me, obviously

probably town:
cur3
ninfia
piplups
sammie
high seraph

very likely maf:
angelstar
alcasync
cure

???:
lulu
luxaria

sweet neutral-chan:
taki


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We're all suspicious of alca to some extent.

I feel like the best way to establish Ezz's alignment at this point, if people still doubt her, is to lynch alca next phase. If we are wrong, then we were horribly wrong and the mafia will probably come really close to winning, with the ratio at 6T:5M at the start of the next day phase. I will also probably indulge the possibility of miller shenanigans because that's how convinced I am that Ezz is town.

(The worst part is that I can actually see how alca's trope could fit into a miller role perfectly.)


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[16:41:10] Kiyo / 7♦: “so lucas what do you think about this lynch?”
[16:41:10] Kiyo / 7♦: “hHHHhhhhhh hHHHHHHHHHH HHHHhhhHHhh"
[16:41:36] lucasssss: "lucas i want u to bus me and lynch me this phase"
[16:41:39] lucasssss: "HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH"
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Hello I am back.

Un momento. Also no actions can be changed I'm back hello here

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